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Dutch no
Thu, 02 Jun 2005 07:04:44

damn, that's irritating. I just watched a stuttering dutch news broadcast on the internet devoted to the dutch no to Europa. There our all-knowing leaders were clear about why the Dutch voted against: no trust in politics. The politicians stand to far from the people. The people are not ready yet for Europe. We are moving to fast for them. The people don't know why they should be for..

To me this would be a clear 'yes!', you are right, the politicians stand to far from the people. It could perhaps be that the people are AGAINST Europe and not not yet for. Or maybe they want a diffirent Europe in stead of being behind a bit from point a to b. And maybe they could even have reasons. Those are scary things of course to let into the national debate, especially since the death of pim fortuyn, after which debating over substance has been abandoned in favor of talking about why politicians never talk about substance anymore.

Not once in that broadcast did i hear anyone talk about substance. Yes actually prime-minister Balkenende for a split second, but in vague terms like 'taking a step back' and 'maybe we should review the situation'. The only real talk about substance came from a very frustrated roadworker who told a politician that he wasn't gonna vote anymore because Europe took away to much from him already before it stopped to ask him about the course it was taking, , after which the politician who asked him was a bit off her balance, laughed her way out of this failed media-attention-window and quickly got away.

And it's not just the politicians, the media refrain just as hard to talk about real issues. A quick view of national newspaper site learns us: Telegraaf: 'the dutch want to slow down', Volkskrant: 'Scism between man in the street and politicians takes it's revenge', Financieel Dagblad (bit criptic): 'The scism, the scism, so it hums'. Aren't there more prisms to choose from. Which secret press-gestapo keeps them in check.

In Sweden they do talk about issues. Sweden doesn't let it's people vote because it is of the opinion that Europe is a bit to important and complicated to let it's people have a say. But the Swedish talk about Europe. And their conclusion basically is that the Dutch and the French say no because they are racist and that it's the (rightwing) extremists that determine the vote. And so this morning i read: '67 percent of the Dutch population are extremists'. No that's of course not true. One of the golden rules of journalism is: NEVER EVER START YOUR HEADLINE WITH A NUMBER!!


on Mon, 06 Jun 2005 07:21:10 muf said:

politicians too far from the people.... If politicians want to be near to these people they will have to deteriorate their intelligence to -273 celcius. And shout things like eigen volk eerst. It's time these non-informed stupid people just shut up. Fortuyn was an extremely stupid nar/ra-cist, not to be taken seriously, but they did. i fear these are the limitations of democracy. A no to EU based on facts and knowledge would be fine for me. From a left-wing perspective there were a few itches in de law, like the law on discrimination which only dealt with discrimination of EU inhabitants. Furthermore, the influence of big companies on EU politics is frightening me. Actually i didn't vote at all as some sort of NO to the whole voting, maybe only beacuse it spoiled the tv broadcasts with stupid crap.

on Mon, 06 Jun 2005 07:24:26 christian said:

Fortuyn did not frighten me as much as Wilders does now, since Wilders is a lot more oppertunistic. And I agree, the majority of people is simply too stupid, these are indeed the limits of democracy, and that's why I am against referenda.

on Mon, 06 Jun 2005 07:42:15 doedje said:

"EUROPE IN CRISIS" was what i read the day after on CNN. That's how stupid journalists can be, influencing people with there stupid stories. For those who live outside the EU, I'll tell ya, life over here is just going on, like it always did.

The Belgium minister of foreign affairs gave his opion about our prime minister in an interview. Something about a great resemblance with Harry Potter and another phrase in dutch which is hard to translate because it's full of typical Dutchness: "de stijfburgerlijkheid bij uitstek". And now the whole of The Hague is all over it, asking the Belgium Ambassador on the carpet.

The only politics that does scare me is the NON-POLITICS we have to deal with here in the Netherlands. Which is giving room to people like Wilders to be heard by the masses. Brrrr.....

I would like to refer to the current dutch political situation as: "De puinhopen na de puinhoop van Paars".

on Wed, 15 Jun 2005 05:26:49 tieze said:

a well, this referendum has certainly proven it's worth. You yourselves must have been utterly disgusted about the way Europe treated the software-patents. And our government was all to happy to play along. If not for a referendum what is there to do about such things?

And to put people aside as being stupid, is perhaps also a bit over the edge. Irrational yes, but you know the dynamics: if there's not a rational way out of a situation, then people tend to choose a non-rational one. What they should have is an alternative with a program which has their interests in mind and which succeeds to convey that. To boycot the whole procedure is to hand Wilders/the EU/etc the ignition key on a golden platter.

on Fri, 17 Jun 2005 15:43:27 muf said:

being stupid is being incapable of being rational i guess.... hit me if i'm wrong. I really think people don't have any interests at all, it's more like a hype.

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